Alan Dershowitz and Michael Hayden versus Alexis Ohanian and Glenn Greenwald, with a video appearance by Edward Snowden.
The actual debate starts around minute 27 on the video. You may use your cursor to click ahead to it.
“Thus, it should be understood that when pro-US figures use the term, 'rules-based international order,' they are not referring to anything analogous to the rule of law. Quite the opposite, they are using Orwellian language to describe a system in which essentially no rules can be established and/or observed, given that the dominant state has the prerogative to violate and/or rewrite “rules” at its whim.” Aaron Good, American Exception